i always want to bang my (helmeted, of course!) head against something when i hear the argument that maureen is giving: it’s dangerous out there! a car could hit you!! you better drive so you’ll be safe!!!
Here in San Jose, CA, we learned not to argue with car drivers. In streets where we know drivers don’t want to share the road, we just use the sidewalks. We know that sidewalks are for pedestrians but there’s hardly any pedestrians here. We use our cars even for short errands around the block. The police seems not to mind the use of the sidewalk by cyclists. It is only when your use of the sidewalk and pedestrian lane leads to an accident with a car or pedestrians that the police will cite you or apply the law.
I try to ride faster than the cars so they can’t catch me to hit me.
Seriously, Seattle is heaven for cyclists. I complain about our streetcar tracks and lots of other little problems here and there, but car drivers are generally very polite inside the city.
@Maureen. Judging by the G8, Kyoto, Bali, etc. Americans don’t like to share anything ;-( (OK, so that’s corporate U$ and Dubya – the real Americans I’ve met are quite generous. Just trying to start a different flame war – anything to get off the ‘H’ word!)
Riding on the sidewalk increases the chance of collision. I know. The only collision I was ever involved in with a car was back when I was foolish enough to do this; the only collision I’ve ever had with a CYCLISTS was with one coming off the SIDEWALK…
If you want to avoid being hit, follow the rules of the road, ride defensively and ride visibly, just as Thistle is doing here. If motorists don’t like sharing the road, that’s their problem not yours.
You started out with great comics about everyday riding, about the joys of cycling and about a little bike store. Now you’re into politics, trying to spread your ideas and to stir up flame war after flame war. Right now, your comic sucks.
Tobi – don’t be such a prat. Rick is still addressing the issues of everyday riding. Here in the UK attitudes like Maureen’s are endemic and part of cycling life.
This is great, and not politics. There’s something about the medium that has a real potential to communicate the challenges of cycling for transportation to lots of people. The visual component is critical. For example in this strip the size and spatial relationship of car to bike is not something everybody has experienced, and the strip communicates that beautifully.
I think Thistle is getting the hang of the utility cycling thing. Only she gets the one liners in right away == I generally don’t come up iwht the snappy comeback until four or five miles later….
I loved how Thistle comes back to her! You go, girl!
And as for Tobi’s comment: This is a cartoon made by a cyclist, and it reflects Rick’s thoughts on cycling, just as Dilbert showcases the corporate worker’s life. And judging from the amount of comments everyday, there are a lot of Yehuda fans around the world!
Just a quick note to let you know I’ll be biking on the Ohio to Erie Trail this weekend so the RSS feed won’t be updated, as I won’t have access to a computer.
How the heck is saying that Americans don’t like to share the road some sort of political statement?
I guess you could debate all day about the phrasing – whether Americans don’t like to share the road or just don’t design the road to promote sharing. But when you get yelled at when you’re well out of the way “get off the road, idiot!” you see that yes, people don’t like to share the road.
And as far as generalizations go – nothing fires up your average American like saying she can’t do something. Thistle’s on that bike to stay now!
Robert in SD – amen. Today’s comic captures perfectly one of my biggest frustrations and it is usually not until 3 days later I think “I should have said this!” I guess that is the benefit of being a cartoon – someone else is writing all your best lines.
Oh wait – I guess it doesn’t say anything about Americans sharing the road. Is it the whole idea of commuting via bike that offends you Tobi? I know that is a political hot-button – one that I don’t quite understand but there you go.
You’re reading the wrong strip, Tobi – Joe commutes by bike a lot too. Not all winter, rain or shine, etc. but when the weather is nice he does.
This mirrors the comic on 0429 about the kid who wanted to ride his bike to school, but CellPhone Mom said no because there are too many CellPhone Moms driving their kids to school at that time. Love it.
And as much as I’m enjoying this thread, I do miss the one-off strips. They had a good cachet to them.
Since going car-free a year ago I’ve been wondering why we don’t have better infrastructure for bikes (in the US). My city is pretty good for bikes apparently, we get awards and things. And there is something to be said for the fact that it’s even *possible* to get around this way. And yet, there are so many holes in our infrastructure. The two main throughways in our town have no bike lanes, and the MUPS are intermittent along them. There is also no continuous north south route at all. You have to jog all over town to get where you want to go! I once counted that I had to turn around and look for another route 5x! (I’m too slow to go faster than the cars, MichaelSnyder
It just surprises me that we are not more advanced in this area.
After reading all our comments. I wonder if part of the reason, is that cyclists still have work to do on uniting our vision. (Myself included.) It’s hard to get what you want from your government if everyone has a different version of what needs to happen. All this is to say that I think the conversations we are having now are healthy for cycling as we begin to find our voice. Thanks for the comic, Rick!
Yeah, I get this everytime someone finds out I bike. I’ll have to remember this comeback
When I told my boss I was going to commute to work his concern was for my safety. He also worried about how “reliable” a bike would be. I just asked him how many things can go wrong with a car to prevent me from getting to work vs. how many things can go wrong with a bike. He was kinda stumped when I told him the only thing I wouldn’t be carrying was a spare rim
Oh, I almost forgot, Toby get lost. We don’t need you flaming the author. You don’t have a say in how the comic is done. If you have such a huge problem just don’t read it for a couple weeks and come back, I’m sure we’ll have covered a ton of ground by then.
You can flame helmets, Bakfietsen, or whatever else about bikes you want, but I draw the line at Rick.
I don’t find it surprising at all considering the amount of money that is paid to politicians by companies that rely on the car being the only choice for Americans to make. When the money stops flowing that way, maybe the political will will start to bend toward a more reasonable infrastructure.
@Jason
Harsh! It’s been one of the things I’ve enjoyed most about this recent run of trips. “Faster!!!”, “Ride … ”
I’m just waiting for slightly weirder toddler noises like “Downshift!”.
Heck, BASE jumping off the Sears Tower is safer than driving to work! Everyone (understandably) likes to be in blissful denial about that aspect of our automobile society.
If you find the task of reversing the bad infrastructure for biking as daunting, it is because we have decades of work by the automobile lobbying groups to be undone.
Right from the end of WWII these forces have been working on each aspect of government planning, be it car-friendly suburban developments or other practices to wean away the population from the transit friendly cities.
@phdbike
Their power is much diminished. Maybe they didn’t go weak much, but other interests grew more powerful.
Ironically, now the Big Three want universal healthcare because they are losing big money on healthcare costs. Are they powerful enough to counter the forces that are against it?
Ok, yes people are entitled to their own opinions but I don’t think it is necessary to be blatantly disrespectful to someone that has given us this great comic to enjoy on a daily basis. Saying it “sucks” is way out of line.
I have been enjoying this strip since I found it. Read the whole back-archive.
As a recumbent cyclist, to appeal to my *ahem* demographic I think it needs a recumbent storyline. A falling out between Joe and Yehuda over stocking recumbents would be interesting.
Only problem is, I can’t decide who is more likely to support them! Yehuda is more “alternative” than Joe, but recumbents are maybe a bit fangled and modern for him. Joe is a roadie, and they traditionally hate recumbents. Then again, he likes speed machines.
Yehuda, we love you. And this series about the Bakfeitsen (sp?) is pretty serenditipitous, as a couple of parent-friends here in Chicago have recently acquired them, and my toddler and I can’t wait to try them out soon…
Here’s my real-life experience of the irony of today’s strip:http://dynobyte.com/baby/?p=44
I think we already have a terrific infrastructure for bikes in this country. Now all we need to do is get the cars off of it.
All kidding aside we do already have the infrastructure we need, we just need an attitude adjustment on the parts of both drivers and cyclists about sharing it.
I agree with you to a certain point. However, I think things such as stop lights that will only trip to green when cars are waiting, merging streets that funnels traffic increasing speed and limiting space, lack of bike racks (in many many communities such as mine) and other amenities helps limit adoption of the bicycle as a useful and efficient means of transportation. The system is nearly completely designed to cater to the private use automobile. All others take a back seat.
Recumbents, I’m lead to believe – are actually quite old. They went out of fashion as the early cycling bodies legislated on upright bikes for races as recumbents had a speed edge (or so I’ve been told)
Was out and about in London today with my Yehuda top on – a couple of folks were trying to read the URL (but looked away when I noticed – that whole ‘mustn’t stare’ thing the anglosphere has going)
I suspect our heroine is not named Thistle for nothing. She’s shown us a number of times how prickly she can be.
Recumbents? There could be a regular customer looking for parts for one. Who would he find most helpful – Yehuda or Joe? Or would they both be stumped?
I’ve been following Yehuda since the beginning, doo. Great cartoon, and the first thing I look at when I get on the net.
@Cycdelicious in San Jose, I am not advocating the use of sidewalks. I am not using the sidewalks myself. I know the dangers of using the sidewalk as a cyslist. I am trying to speak for the majority of bike commuters here in San Jose who are mostly using their bikes going to work and not for recreation and fitness. The areas you cited, the more affluent parts of Santa Clara, are places where you don’t usually find these bike commuters I am referring to. These are the paisanos on a daily grind who won’t even know how to appreciate why we are still debating the use of the sidewalk. They consider themselves pedestrian on bikes. And they see nothing wrong in this since there are almost no pedestrians using them, anyway. I used to be pissed off with them but then I learned to be more compassionate and understanding. And when I am driving a car, I watch out for them. They are just trying to make a living like me;)
This strip rocks! Todays is so great because of her comeback to such a common line against cyclists. I’ve been thinking about a comeback to “roads are for cars, not bikes” like “then get out of your car and let it drive itself, its obviously not for people!”
@lisa – Great idea for a website, MothersAgainstDriving.org, sounds awesome.
Yeah I know, they’ve been around since at least the 1890′s. Problem is, most of em don’t look it. Many of the current designs are extremely hightech (the Velocraft Nocom for example).
I agree with Tobi from the first page of comments, I wouldn’t say at all that anything sucks though. I miss the everyday riding and bike shop happenings. Might you guys be able to see that if you aren’t into cargo bikes and commuting this series might be getting a little boring? Not bad, but just not as interesting. Thistle also has this weird edgy attitude that seems to suggest she has something to prove, I can’t really relate, I’m not mad at the world. Although, possibly something might aspire for her as a result.
Some of you guys really make me laugh. You’ve been trying to hook Yehuda up with a married woman since before we met her and now her concerned (however misguided) friend ran over Fred?
I don’t use sidewalks, but see a lot of folks using them. There are a lot more cyclists out this summer than last, and a lot of them ride on the sidewalk, or against traffic or whatever. I actually jumped all over third cyclist who nearly hit me from behind today while playing pedestrian. I don’t think he understood that I know cycling. (punk bmx type)
my average mph is well above the 11mph figure mentioned here, and isn’t conducive to sidewaks anyway.
Sadly it’s the same concensus of opinion the world over!
i always want to bang my (helmeted, of course!) head against something when i hear the argument that maureen is giving: it’s dangerous out there! a car could hit you!! you better drive so you’ll be safe!!!
heaven forbid you’d be a part of the solution…
Here in San Jose, CA, we learned not to argue with car drivers. In streets where we know drivers don’t want to share the road, we just use the sidewalks. We know that sidewalks are for pedestrians but there’s hardly any pedestrians here. We use our cars even for short errands around the block. The police seems not to mind the use of the sidewalk by cyclists. It is only when your use of the sidewalk and pedestrian lane leads to an accident with a car or pedestrians that the police will cite you or apply the law.
This is why my parents don’t want me riding, that I’ll get hit.
I try to ride faster than the cars so they can’t catch me to hit me.
Seriously, Seattle is heaven for cyclists. I complain about our streetcar tracks and lots of other little problems here and there, but car drivers are generally very polite inside the city.
@Maureen. Judging by the G8, Kyoto, Bali, etc. Americans don’t like to share anything ;-( (OK, so that’s corporate U$ and Dubya – the real Americans I’ve met are quite generous. Just trying to start a different flame war – anything to get off the ‘H’ word!)
Riding on the sidewalk increases the chance of collision. I know. The only collision I was ever involved in with a car was back when I was foolish enough to do this; the only collision I’ve ever had with a CYCLISTS was with one coming off the SIDEWALK…
If you want to avoid being hit, follow the rules of the road, ride defensively and ride visibly, just as Thistle is doing here. If motorists don’t like sharing the road, that’s their problem not yours.
‘Nuff said.
Rick, I think it’s enough.
You started out with great comics about everyday riding, about the joys of cycling and about a little bike store. Now you’re into politics, trying to spread your ideas and to stir up flame war after flame war. Right now, your comic sucks.
Tobi
Get lost Tobi – it’s your comment that sucks. What politics? Bikes are road vehicles, Thistle’s on the road, what’s the problem?
Tobi – don’t be such a prat. Rick is still addressing the issues of everyday riding. Here in the UK attitudes like Maureen’s are endemic and part of cycling life.
Get over it…
This is such a common occurance.
its not politics, just life.
Keep it up Rick.
This is great, and not politics. There’s something about the medium that has a real potential to communicate the challenges of cycling for transportation to lots of people. The visual component is critical. For example in this strip the size and spatial relationship of car to bike is not something everybody has experienced, and the strip communicates that beautifully.
I think Thistle is getting the hang of the utility cycling thing. Only she gets the one liners in right away == I generally don’t come up iwht the snappy comeback until four or five miles later….
“Cause summer’s here and the time is right for fighting in the street, boy…”
I loved how Thistle comes back to her! You go, girl!
And as for Tobi’s comment: This is a cartoon made by a cyclist, and it reflects Rick’s thoughts on cycling, just as Dilbert showcases the corporate worker’s life. And judging from the amount of comments everyday, there are a lot of Yehuda fans around the world!
Just a quick note to let you know I’ll be biking on the Ohio to Erie Trail this weekend so the RSS feed won’t be updated, as I won’t have access to a computer.
The strip *will* still update…
is that a huge suv? the person telling her it’s not safe is driving in a large truck. it’s like a war zone sometimes
It’s blue……..
How the heck is saying that Americans don’t like to share the road some sort of political statement?
I guess you could debate all day about the phrasing – whether Americans don’t like to share the road or just don’t design the road to promote sharing. But when you get yelled at when you’re well out of the way “get off the road, idiot!” you see that yes, people don’t like to share the road.
And as far as generalizations go – nothing fires up your average American like saying she can’t do something. Thistle’s on that bike to stay now!
Great strip, don’t change a thing. Tobi, go sit down in your cube farm and shut up!
Rick- I’ll be doing the southern part of the trail this weekend also. Hope to see you there.
Robert in SD – amen. Today’s comic captures perfectly one of my biggest frustrations and it is usually not until 3 days later I think “I should have said this!” I guess that is the benefit of being a cartoon – someone else is writing all your best lines.
Oh wait – I guess it doesn’t say anything about Americans sharing the road. Is it the whole idea of commuting via bike that offends you Tobi? I know that is a political hot-button – one that I don’t quite understand but there you go.
You’re reading the wrong strip, Tobi – Joe commutes by bike a lot too. Not all winter, rain or shine, etc. but when the weather is nice he does.
Nice sweat-rings! Go, Girl, Go!
This mirrors the comic on 0429 about the kid who wanted to ride his bike to school, but CellPhone Mom said no because there are too many CellPhone Moms driving their kids to school at that time. Love it.
And as much as I’m enjoying this thread, I do miss the one-off strips. They had a good cachet to them.
Carry on.
Since going car-free a year ago I’ve been wondering why we don’t have better infrastructure for bikes (in the US). My city is pretty good for bikes apparently, we get awards and things. And there is something to be said for the fact that it’s even *possible* to get around this way. And yet, there are so many holes in our infrastructure. The two main throughways in our town have no bike lanes, and the MUPS are intermittent along them. There is also no continuous north south route at all. You have to jog all over town to get where you want to go! I once counted that I had to turn around and look for another route 5x! (I’m too slow to go faster than the cars, MichaelSnyder
It just surprises me that we are not more advanced in this area.
After reading all our comments. I wonder if part of the reason, is that cyclists still have work to do on uniting our vision. (Myself included.) It’s hard to get what you want from your government if everyone has a different version of what needs to happen. All this is to say that I think the conversations we are having now are healthy for cycling as we begin to find our voice. Thanks for the comic, Rick!
R those sweat stains? Go Thistle!
Yeah, I get this everytime someone finds out I bike. I’ll have to remember this comeback
When I told my boss I was going to commute to work his concern was for my safety. He also worried about how “reliable” a bike would be. I just asked him how many things can go wrong with a car to prevent me from getting to work vs. how many things can go wrong with a bike. He was kinda stumped when I told him the only thing I wouldn’t be carrying was a spare rim
Oh, I almost forgot, Toby get lost. We don’t need you flaming the author. You don’t have a say in how the comic is done. If you have such a huge problem just don’t read it for a couple weeks and come back, I’m sure we’ll have covered a ton of ground by then.
You can flame helmets, Bakfietsen, or whatever else about bikes you want, but I draw the line at Rick.
She didn’t buy the helmet! (See July 9) I would’ve sided with Joe.
@Nickie
I don’t find it surprising at all considering the amount of money that is paid to politicians by companies that rely on the car being the only choice for Americans to make. When the money stops flowing that way, maybe the political will will start to bend toward a more reasonable infrastructure.
pit stains! hehe
Mark: Let Toby criticise Rick when he has his own world-class comic strip.
Rick: Enjoy the trail!
the baby’s dialogue could be improved..
Ok Jason, everybody is being tough on Toby, but that was harsh.
Americans don’t like to damage their cars. Hitting a cyclist scratches the paint.
@Jason
Harsh! It’s been one of the things I’ve enjoyed most about this recent run of trips. “Faster!!!”, “Ride … ”
I’m just waiting for slightly weirder toddler noises like “Downshift!”.
Wait, let Toby criticize Rick. I’m pretty sure he would like to see what his readers think.
You seriously think that is going to stop Rick from doing the strip the way he does it?
Yeah right.
Again good to see that the majority likes the way things are going.
Risk ? I
Heck, BASE jumping off the Sears Tower is safer than driving to work! Everyone (understandably) likes to be in blissful denial about that aspect of our automobile society.
@Nickie
If you find the task of reversing the bad infrastructure for biking as daunting, it is because we have decades of work by the automobile lobbying groups to be undone.
Right from the end of WWII these forces have been working on each aspect of government planning, be it car-friendly suburban developments or other practices to wean away the population from the transit friendly cities.
@phdbike
Their power is much diminished. Maybe they didn’t go weak much, but other interests grew more powerful.
Ironically, now the Big Three want universal healthcare because they are losing big money on healthcare costs. Are they powerful enough to counter the forces that are against it?
Ok, yes people are entitled to their own opinions but I don’t think it is necessary to be blatantly disrespectful to someone that has given us this great comic to enjoy on a daily basis. Saying it “sucks” is way out of line.
Maybe it really sucks for him.
I know it rocks for me.
Second that – my son asked me the other day “Daddy? Why do you always look at Yehuda Moon when you get on the computer?” LOL
I have been enjoying this strip since I found it. Read the whole back-archive.
As a recumbent cyclist, to appeal to my *ahem* demographic I think it needs a recumbent storyline. A falling out between Joe and Yehuda over stocking recumbents would be interesting.
Only problem is, I can’t decide who is more likely to support them! Yehuda is more “alternative” than Joe, but recumbents are maybe a bit fangled and modern for him. Joe is a roadie, and they traditionally hate recumbents. Then again, he likes speed machines.
It’s a toss-up.
Sidewalk riders like Rene are the ones getting hit by cars in San Jose. I and hundreds of other cyclists ride safely on Stevens Creek Blvd, Park Avenue, Moorepark, Saratoga Road, ECR / The Alameda / Santa Clara Street, and elsewhere all over San Jose. Photographic proof:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2381366623/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2656550812/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2389584275/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2252101262/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bike/2329437254/
…&cetera.
Yehuda, we love you. And this series about the Bakfeitsen (sp?) is pretty serenditipitous, as a couple of parent-friends here in Chicago have recently acquired them, and my toddler and I can’t wait to try them out soon…
Here’s my real-life experience of the irony of today’s strip:http://dynobyte.com/baby/?p=44
Rick (and Rick), have fun!
I think we already have a terrific infrastructure for bikes in this country. Now all we need to do is get the cars off of it.
All kidding aside we do already have the infrastructure we need, we just need an attitude adjustment on the parts of both drivers and cyclists about sharing it.
@Opus the Poet
I agree with you to a certain point. However, I think things such as stop lights that will only trip to green when cars are waiting, merging streets that funnels traffic increasing speed and limiting space, lack of bike racks (in many many communities such as mine) and other amenities helps limit adoption of the bicycle as a useful and efficient means of transportation. The system is nearly completely designed to cater to the private use automobile. All others take a back seat.
@AbrasiveScotsman
Recumbents, I’m lead to believe – are actually quite old. They went out of fashion as the early cycling bodies legislated on upright bikes for races as recumbents had a speed edge (or so I’ve been told)
Was out and about in London today with my Yehuda top on – a couple of folks were trying to read the URL (but looked away when I noticed – that whole ‘mustn’t stare’ thing the anglosphere has going)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/murky/2658449683/
I suspect our heroine is not named Thistle for nothing. She’s shown us a number of times how prickly she can be.
Recumbents? There could be a regular customer looking for parts for one. Who would he find most helpful – Yehuda or Joe? Or would they both be stumped?
I’ve been following Yehuda since the beginning, doo. Great cartoon, and the first thing I look at when I get on the net.
@Cycdelicious in San Jose, I am not advocating the use of sidewalks. I am not using the sidewalks myself. I know the dangers of using the sidewalk as a cyslist. I am trying to speak for the majority of bike commuters here in San Jose who are mostly using their bikes going to work and not for recreation and fitness. The areas you cited, the more affluent parts of Santa Clara, are places where you don’t usually find these bike commuters I am referring to. These are the paisanos on a daily grind who won’t even know how to appreciate why we are still debating the use of the sidewalk. They consider themselves pedestrian on bikes. And they see nothing wrong in this since there are almost no pedestrians using them, anyway. I used to be pissed off with them but then I learned to be more compassionate and understanding. And when I am driving a car, I watch out for them. They are just trying to make a living like me;)
Uncle Phil, (u from Bel Air?)
Yehuda is what I look the first thing when I wake up and the last thing before I go to sleep.
I wonder if Maureen knows something from what happened about an year ago?
This strip rocks! Todays is so great because of her comeback to such a common line against cyclists. I’ve been thinking about a comeback to “roads are for cars, not bikes” like “then get out of your car and let it drive itself, its obviously not for people!”
@lisa – Great idea for a website, MothersAgainstDriving.org, sounds awesome.
@ Murk
Yeah I know, they’ve been around since at least the 1890′s. Problem is, most of em don’t look it. Many of the current designs are extremely hightech (the Velocraft Nocom for example).
I’m not sure that’d be to Yahuda’s taste
I agree with Tobi from the first page of comments, I wouldn’t say at all that anything sucks though. I miss the everyday riding and bike shop happenings. Might you guys be able to see that if you aren’t into cargo bikes and commuting this series might be getting a little boring? Not bad, but just not as interesting. Thistle also has this weird edgy attitude that seems to suggest she has something to prove, I can’t really relate, I’m not mad at the world. Although, possibly something might aspire for her as a result.
maybe it sucks being tobi.
perhaps we shouldn’t hold him entirely responsible;
maybe we should.
@the mostly reverend
I totally agree, if he isn’t enjoying the strip it definately sucks to be tobi
Well on a different note, what color so you think Maureen’s car is? =)
Some of you guys really make me laugh. You’ve been trying to hook Yehuda up with a married woman since before we met her and now her concerned (however misguided) friend ran over Fred?
I don’t use sidewalks, but see a lot of folks using them. There are a lot more cyclists out this summer than last, and a lot of them ride on the sidewalk, or against traffic or whatever. I actually jumped all over third cyclist who nearly hit me from behind today while playing pedestrian. I don’t think he understood that I know cycling. (punk bmx type)
my average mph is well above the 11mph figure mentioned here, and isn’t conducive to sidewaks anyway.
Ryan, looks like you are upto something. hmmm…………