Comments on: 07/06/2008 – First Hill! Second Hill… http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/ Wed, 19 Jun 2013 22:59:24 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: BAW http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43625 BAW Mon, 01 Dec 2008 19:52:23 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43625 The BAK is fine for the Netherlands, which are as flat as a pancake, but many cities in the US have hills. The BAK is fine for the Netherlands, which are as flat as a pancake, but many cities in the US have hills.

]]> By: Mark http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43626 Mark Wed, 09 Jul 2008 13:51:31 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43626 Oops, sry my math was off there. Been kinda out of it lately. An electric bike costs about $.07 per charge, which is about 1025 miles depending on weight and how fast you go. Oops, sry my math was off there. Been kinda out of it lately. An electric bike costs about $.07 per charge, which is about 1025 miles depending on weight and how fast you go.

]]> By: Mark http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43627 Mark Tue, 08 Jul 2008 08:43:52 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43627 Hey Ian, I'm a big advocate for the electric assist bikes. Because I decided right out of high school to go into the working class and live on my own, a large majority of jobs I had were delivery or onsite customer support so I speant most of my time in the car. Sometimes I had to work 2 jobs to make ends meet and that left little time for excersize. Well, I covered about 170,000 miles in a little over a year and a half, gained about 65 pounds and now that I'm back in school I wanted to get back on the bike and out of the car. Where I live thats difficult due to all the hills in the area because I don't want to get to work drenched in sweat and the same goes for school. The electric assist opens that door and I get my excersize on the way home. Sure many say I'm "cheating", but I say whatever gets me back in the saddle works. Even with the motor I only use it on hills so I still get a fair workout on the flats. E-bikes are great for people in my situation or with handicaps. Also at around $.07 per mile it's way cheaper than the car. My math could be wrong so it might be cheaper than that. Hey Ian,
I’m a big advocate for the electric assist bikes. Because I decided right out of high school to go into the working class and live on my own, a large majority of jobs I had were delivery or onsite customer support so I speant most of my time in the car. Sometimes I had to work 2 jobs to make ends meet and that left little time for excersize. Well, I covered about 170,000 miles in a little over a year and a half, gained about 65 pounds and now that I’m back in school I wanted to get back on the bike and out of the car. Where I live thats difficult due to all the hills in the area because I don’t want to get to work drenched in sweat and the same goes for school. The electric assist opens that door and I get my excersize on the way home. Sure many say I’m “cheating”, but I say whatever gets me back in the saddle works. Even with the motor I only use it on hills so I still get a fair workout on the flats. E-bikes are great for people in my situation or with handicaps.
Also at around $.07 per mile it’s way cheaper than the car. My math could be wrong so it might be cheaper than that.

]]> By: Ian Hopper http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43628 Ian Hopper Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:44:00 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43628 Mike, my main issue with the 8spd hub is how the final gearing is usually geared. Every time I leave my home, I've got a 22degree grade to descend which is FUN but really taxes the hub brakes on the Azor Oma, especially with boyo in the PeaPod. It ALSO means that I come UP that same hill every time I return home. The boy and bike (as it's set up now with PeaPod and GIANT wald basket strapped to an Azor Pickup frame mounted front rack) and his lunch box weigh about 126lbs, I'm fluctuating around 190lbs, so the average total is around 320 lbs before I add groceries, etc. The lowest gear (it's an 8spd shimano internal hub with a 44/22 (the biggest rear cog I could use and still have the full enclosed chain case) is 29.4 gear inches (per Sheldon's calc) or 2.2 Gain Ratio. Dropping to a 40t in the front drops the low end to 26.4 or 2 Gain Ratio. The problem is, this still isn't low enough and the top end is now suffering badly. To get the climbing ability I want, I need the low end to be 20 gear inches or 1.5 Gain Ratio. I don't need it that often, but when I need it, I NEED it. Did I mention I hate pushing heavy bikes up hill on foot? I do it anyway and the boy is big enough I make him get off and walk despite his occasional protests. The problem with this low of a ratio on the low end virtually destroys my higher end gears. If you're hills are mild and the gearing is appropriate for the loads you carry, you are absolutely right, the shimano hubs are more than adequate. For me and my cargo bike (a big dummy), I got a Rohloff. Yeah, I know, they're expensive as hell, but many are they worth it. I only wish I could get an enclosed chain case for a long tail... So... to sum up, I'd like the Bak more for my personal use if it had the option of a Rohloff and/or an electric motor. HOOO! I said it! "Electric Bike"... now I've opened Pandoras box... Mike, my main issue with the 8spd hub is how the final gearing is usually geared. Every time I leave my home, I’ve got a 22degree grade to descend which is FUN but really taxes the hub brakes on the Azor Oma, especially with boyo in the PeaPod. It ALSO means that I come UP that same hill every time I return home. The boy and bike (as it’s set up now with PeaPod and GIANT wald basket strapped to an Azor Pickup frame mounted front rack) and his lunch box weigh about 126lbs, I’m fluctuating around 190lbs, so the average total is around 320 lbs before I add groceries, etc. The lowest gear (it’s an 8spd shimano internal hub with a 44/22 (the biggest rear cog I could use and still have the full enclosed chain case) is 29.4 gear inches (per Sheldon’s calc) or 2.2 Gain Ratio. Dropping to a 40t in the front drops the low end to 26.4 or 2 Gain Ratio. The problem is, this still isn’t low enough and the top end is now suffering badly. To get the climbing ability I want, I need the low end to be 20 gear inches or 1.5 Gain Ratio. I don’t need it that often, but when I need it, I NEED it. Did I mention I hate pushing heavy bikes up hill on foot? I do it anyway and the boy is big enough I make him get off and walk despite his occasional protests. The problem with this low of a ratio on the low end virtually destroys my higher end gears.

If you’re hills are mild and the gearing is appropriate for the loads you carry, you are absolutely right, the shimano hubs are more than adequate. For me and my cargo bike (a big dummy), I got a Rohloff. Yeah, I know, they’re expensive as hell, but many are they worth it. I only wish I could get an enclosed chain case for a long tail…
So… to sum up, I’d like the Bak more for my personal use if it had the option of a Rohloff and/or an electric motor. HOOO! I said it! “Electric Bike”… now I’ve opened Pandoras box…

]]> By: mike http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43629 mike Mon, 07 Jul 2008 09:54:03 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43629 Quote: "(CAT) in Oregon sells one geared like a mountain bike (this would be MY preference for where *I* live (Marin County, CA = lots of hills!)" The CAT version is more of a Danish long john and really doesn't compare to a Bakfiets in terms of kid / family friendly design. You would be surprised how far 8 speeds will get you. There was a healthy discussion of this on the CleverCycles blog, with charts and graphs. 305% for the Shimano Nexus from low to high is a nice range - and while 'more' can sometimes be better - its not always the case. The internal gearing of the bak means full chaincase, no derailer to mess with, and little to no maintenance of the drive train. These are designed for everyday family transport - and they are left in the weather most of the time. Anything that would add maintenance, fidgeting, fussing, and fixing on a regular (annoying) basis would take away from the simplicity of just getting on and going... Quote: “(CAT) in Oregon sells one geared like a mountain bike (this would be MY preference for where *I* live (Marin County, CA = lots of hills!)”

The CAT version is more of a Danish long john and really doesn’t compare to a Bakfiets in terms of kid / family friendly design.

You would be surprised how far 8 speeds will get you. There was a healthy discussion of this on the CleverCycles blog, with charts and graphs. 305% for the Shimano Nexus from low to high is a nice range – and while ‘more’ can sometimes be better – its not always the case. The internal gearing of the bak means full chaincase, no derailer to mess with, and little to no maintenance of the drive train. These are designed for everyday family transport – and they are left in the weather most of the time. Anything that would add maintenance, fidgeting, fussing, and fixing on a regular (annoying) basis would take away from the simplicity of just getting on and going…

]]> By: Ian Hopper http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43630 Ian Hopper Mon, 07 Jul 2008 04:37:04 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43630 Some bakfiets (mainly the ones sold in Holland) ARE single speeds, but most of the ones sold in the states are multi-speed. CleverCycles in Portland O.R sells 8 speed shimano internal hub versions, and the Center for Appropriate Transportation (CAT) in Oregon sells one geared like a mountain bike (this would be MY preference for where *I* live (Marin County, CA = lots of hills!). They aren't cheap, but they're a LOT cheaper than a new car and they require no gasoline once you've bought them. Aside from wide range gearing, an human/electric hybrid system might be a good alternative to a car in hilly country.. of course, you can add an xtracycle to your standard MTB for quite a bit cheaper, though the set-up is quite different. The baks ride very smooth, even more so with a load. The have a suprisingly short turning radius considering their length, but I'm USED to riding long wheelbase HPV's... Some bakfiets (mainly the ones sold in Holland) ARE single speeds, but most of the ones sold in the states are multi-speed. CleverCycles in Portland O.R sells 8 speed shimano internal hub versions, and the Center for Appropriate Transportation (CAT) in Oregon sells one geared like a mountain bike (this would be MY preference for where *I* live (Marin County, CA = lots of hills!). They aren’t cheap, but they’re a LOT cheaper than a new car and they require no gasoline once you’ve bought them. Aside from wide range gearing, an human/electric hybrid system might be a good alternative to a car in hilly country.. of course, you can add an xtracycle to your standard MTB for quite a bit cheaper, though the set-up is quite different. The baks ride very smooth, even more so with a load. The have a suprisingly short turning radius considering their length, but I’m USED to riding long wheelbase HPV’s…

]]> By: Anonymous http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43631 Anonymous Mon, 07 Jul 2008 04:17:10 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43631 Whoa, sorry I didn't read yesterday's comments so I had no idea there was a whole debate about helmets. No need to tell me to shut up or call me a troll. Thanks. Whoa, sorry I didn’t read yesterday’s comments so I had no idea there was a whole debate about helmets. No need to tell me to shut up or call me a troll. Thanks.

]]> By: Wondering http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43632 Wondering Mon, 07 Jul 2008 03:23:20 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43632 IS the bak gearless? IS the bak gearless?

]]> By: Sirrus Rider http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43633 Sirrus Rider Mon, 07 Jul 2008 03:07:13 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43633 Well shucks. I'm just a little envious of the little girl. It must be fun riding around in that wheelbarrow bucket. :) Well shucks. I’m just a little envious of the little girl. It must be fun riding around in that wheelbarrow bucket. :)

]]> By: Mike Schwab http://yehudamoon.com/20080706/#comment-43634 Mike Schwab Mon, 07 Jul 2008 02:49:58 +0000 http://localhost/kickstandcomics/07062008/#comment-43634 JohnB, that is a still photo from the movie "(We aren't blocking traffic,) We Are Traffic" about the San Franciso Critical Mass ride, especialy the 1997 Police Riot. http://www.tedwhitegreenlight.com/cm.htm http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=189314458200750949 (50 minutes) JohnB, that is a still photo from the movie “(We aren’t blocking traffic,) We Are Traffic” about the San Franciso Critical Mass ride, especialy the 1997 Police Riot.
http://www.tedwhitegreenlight.com/cm.htm
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=189314458200750949 (50 minutes)

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